On Episode 9 We will be talking with Terry Penny who is known in our local Community of investors and Wholesalers to being a great business woman and all around Entrepreneur.
After graduating from business school at age 18, I was headed for the entrepreneur life. At age 19, I started a successful legal service and have provided services for over 200 attorneys in the Metro Detroit area. I enthusiastically entered the real estate industry at age 23 and have never looked back. Real estate has been my passion for over 30 years and I've mentored several new investors across the country since 2001. I've had the pleasure of providing consultations, corporate structuring and business & real estate financing for my clients. I'm a mom of 4 boys, and after the passing of my husband in 2020, I felt the need to obtain my Life Insurance license to help families with their estate planning, and to avoid the financial burden when a loved one is lost.
www.TerryPenny.com
www.CorleonRealEstate.com
www.PennysVacationRentals.com
www.CorAgentLegal.com
This is for everyone out there who want to know about Metro Detroit Off Market real estate. We will be interviewing people every week and taking questions from everyone in the comments or they can come on video with us. we will post the link in the chat when the LIVE starts for those who want to come on video with us.
If you want to JV with me on any deals in Metro Detroit market Contact me though
E-Mail: RandyBuysHousesMi@gmail.com
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So real quick before you did that
and your your origin story like how did you get into is that he uh he made an age joke the last time we were I'm
gonna I'm gonna use that kooka
hey everybody how's it going welcome to another episode of real estate talk with
Randy Stedwell we just tried out this intro that came in uh you know so let me
know what you think in the comments so who we have for episode nine is Terry
Penny honestly I've seen her at all the meetups and I I've looked up to her as
well I see a lot of stuff that she puts out so I'm very very excited and very happy to have her on this show she there
there's a honestly there's probably nothing that I if it's real estate
related she's probably done it or getting into it so with that being said if you have
questions throughout this podcast please put them in the chat I we will answer them as we go you'll
get whatever you'll get my opinion on it and as well as probably most importantly you'll get hurt her response to it so
again put them in the chat here whether you're on YouTube or you're on our Facebook Channel all right uh try to
go to our YouTube so we can get some get the algorithm more uh going in there in that direction and I can actually post
your name in here otherwise like I'm just gonna have to say your name when you have questions
with that being said welcome Terry Penny how you doing hey Randy how you doing awesome awesome
so I'm very excited to have you on the show all right
I know you you've seen some of the shows that we've had uh and I'm very happy to uh you agree with it to be able
enough to be able to come on and and share your experience with this so good
to be here glad I'm I'm I you know you've got you've had some great shows I've watched a few of them so thank you
I really do appreciate it you're a very busy woman so I understand that you
know and today we have we uh re-accommodated for being on Thursday I
want to apologize everybody that this is normally on a Monday night at 8pm we're
doing it Thursday because I had some personal stuff happen I don't want to get into exactly what it was but either
way you know everything's taken care of everyone's safe no problem so I you know
with that being said uh thank you Terry penny for having
I you know for accommodating the the change and everything like that and what's actually really cool is your your
name is actually my mother's name so Terry yeah so
a lovely woman she is she's a very lovely woman very lovely woman so
anyways tell me a little bit about your uh how you got started and
you know how you got into real estate in general okay
we gotta go back more than 30 years I got my real estate license in 1992.
so it's been 31 years I started with real estate one
I'm currently with exp okay and update I just passed the broker's
exam on Tuesday so I am now a broker and the
reason for doing that just to Fast Forward Thinking is I'm opening a property management
company so I've been managed my own my own properties for 30 years and I'm
partnering with my contractor who's also been in construction for 30 years so right but but to answer your question
yeah I got started as a realtor in 92.
my first year so it was so different back then because I was at like a 45 commission and my
last was literally a book that someone had we didn't have the internet back then right so right right come into the
office and actually look through a book of all the listings and everything and we would submit our offers standing at the fax
machine so so I probably I think I lost more money than I made my first year
and then I got into learning about investing and that's when it changed
really everything I wasn't a very good realtor and I'm not a good realtor now 30 years later
because off Market is my comfort zone I I have access to the MLS but I
really don't do anything with it other than checking comps doing CMAs doing uh
research for my own investing or for wholesaling so I've been
wholesaling for over 30 years but off markets my comfort zone even though I'm licensed got it so that's another reason
why I like bringing it on and why I follow you is because you're a fellow wholesaler so uh you know first of all
it it's really cool on that and how did so when you got
into real estate you you started as a bro as a agent you said right yeah and I
was 23. You were 23. okay and you weren't really that great of an agent
fight anyone before I started okay yeah how did uh so how did going
from being an agent to wholesale or the next step that you
did so I I realized once I started learning
about investing how different the realtor world was from the investor
World so in the 90s
so my husband uh stayed up a lot later than I did and
he was watching the late night infomercials that came on and
I don't know if anyone's listening is old enough to remember the late night infomercials that came out at like three
o'clock in the morning and there was this guy with a mustache in Florida that
was talking about fixing up houses and increasing the value and you know making
rents and it all made sense and so my husband was like you gotta watch this because you already know something about
real estate so you know this all makes sense to me and so we were so you
know fast forward I understand the seminar circuit now because we end up working
for the company but back then you know they have the free the free seminar not webinar was no
webinars it was a seminar you actually had to show up in person right and so there was uh the free seminar and then
they sold you on the three-day weekend right I mean this is the same stuff that's been going on for decades right I
mean it's still going on one of the courses I bought was from Carlton Sheets if anyone remembers that name okay so
the no money down stuff so I'm really dating myself but it was so different back then so
anyways we showed up we did the three then when they did the three day and that just taught you just enough to
be dangerous right yeah and so then they upsell sold you on the bigger packages and and so forth so we spent
over thirty thousand dollars for our our education package but it was worth every
Penn any and I always even people that I Mentor now I tell them you're either going to pay for your your your
education now or you're going to pay for it later in lawsuits or or damages or or
loss losses because you didn't you know how to analyze the property you know and
you're going to lose money on and then and then of course this real estate thing doesn't work because it didn't
work for you because you didn't get your education before you got into this business exactly but anyway so I
understand the value of education and so we had no problem spending the money
you know and we were taking boot camps which means you actually got on a plane and traveled to Georgia and Texas
and Florida and and you know where are they they held the boot camps but it was
three or four days of nothing but information about just that subject whether it was you know foreclosures or
you know the rentals or you know uh
lease options or anything that you wanted to learn about but so we went through this intense training
but I really felt like you know I had a PhD in in real estate when we were
done and then when we when we went through all the
classes and when you got all the education and everything we were assigned a mentor and and stuff
we had made a goal to buy
10 rentals by the end of that year and there was I think February so it was we had less than a year to accomplish
our goal and so the reason for our goal was
uh because at the time I've always been self-employed I've been self-employed since I was 19.
so I I've never been into the W-2 world that I've always been I wouldn't be a
very good employee but but anyways I've always been self-motivated
I've been on my own since I back up a little bit I graduated at 17 I
graduated from business school at 18. self-employed 19 a self-motivator had to right
So anyways my husband was working as a corrections officer
for a maximum security psychiatric prison it's very stressful yeah and so
our goal was to accumulate enough parentals so that the uh the cash flow
the total cash flow would substitute his salary at the prison
yep and then we would be financially independent basically off of our rentals and he could quit his job that was
our goal and our goal was to have it accomplished by the end of the year so
with the organization that we were with was Russ Whitney again if anyone's old enough to
remember Russ Whitney that was the guy on the infomercial with the mustache but we're still friends today
but anyways we went through the all these
intense training and and everything and in the organization it was important to set goals and so we set our goals and at
the end of the year we accomplished nine rentals we didn't accomplish 10 but we did get nine by the end of the year
so because of that the so so Russ's uh
uh Whitney education they were bringing they were the largest real estate education company in the world they were
in seven different countries okay they were bringing 60 000 new students a month right so over 700 000 new students
a month they would choose five people to put into the Hall of Fame
based on some and so forth so my husband and I counted as one of those five right
because we were cut that's awesome and so we made Hall of Fame based on our accomplishments and everything and
so that kind of in such a large organization kind of put us in
a real good position because that's where Russ hired his trainers okay was from his Hall of
Famers right because you can't expect someone to teach you
how to be successful if they haven't been successful themselves that is correct yes if you haven't successfully
done a lease option from point A to points you can't tell me how to do it if
you haven't made a million dollars you can't teach me how to do it right so it's important that who you give your
money to that teach you something has actually been there done that and not just a couple times right so
because every deal is going to be different and you know how to you know you got to know how to get through the
obstacles exactly so anyways so we went on to be mentors for his company
and did that for about seven years or so I we our children were young so I was
doing more of the phone mentoring and and uh at that point we were having emails and stuff
which was what dial up right I mean yeah so but my husband actually
uh traveled and he'd spend you know about four days with a student in their own
backyard driving for dollars getting their power teams set up actually
they're putting in offers sometimes actually got an accepted offer before he flew out of town so it was it was very
very valuable training and that's how like since 2001 I've been mentoring people as well
based on that same you know education based
which I don't know nowadays I it kind of seems to be a little watered down and
stuff and everybody's a guru because they've done a few deals right so anyways I just I just make
sure people mentoring is not only what I do and stuff but I do I like to help people get started
I'm real big on learning different strategies because when when I approach
a seller I've already analyzed the property four or five different ways and so when I get
to the seller I'm going to present them with three or four different offers make them let them make the decision of what
works for them so that they feel like they're more in control and not being taken advantage of which I already know
every one of these that I'm presenting is going to work for me one way or another right but like for example
you know if you don't know subject two you might be passing up some deals
because all you know is wholesaling so that lowball cash offer isn't going to work for your seller and because of your
lack of knowledge you you can't take that deal down where I'm going to pay them in behind you and really dig into
what the seller's issue is so I can solve their problem because that's what
this is mostly about it's good when you can make money at the same time solving the seller's problems most definitely
and real quick I just want to interject here you hear everyone out there you
hear talking about all these different options subject to lease option things of that nature
keep those in in your mind and any questions that you have about those
please go ahead and put them in the chat and as we talk about them we'll get to your question and we'll be able to
answer them so mainly from her perspective since she's done them so uh
you know uh with that being said I 100 agree with you I'm here to try to
help as many people as I can but I don't pretend that I had 10 years experience
in this I don't these are I'm very upfront and honest with the experience that I do have and
and if you're looking just to get started and and run the numbers things like that by all means you're I'm an
open book so but I think there's a huge tremendous value in pain for a course
because you're taking all of the mistakes that they went through and said
hey don't do this do this do that so on and so forth go into this trajectory if
you want to hit that now if you don't follow that's on you but at least they're giving you a guideline
and you're paying for that you're paying for the mentorship you're paying for the
the course and so on and so forth so I really appreciate that just want to interject that a little bit here but uh
go ahead and continue on sorry yeah they could be costly mistakes oh yeah you know it could get you sued oh yeah you
know this is not this is no one wants to be sued okay right
right so I've never been sued that I'm Gonna Knock on Wood because of that
because you can be sued for frivolous things and it could just cost you a tremendous amount of money for being
just for being sued okay yeah I mean it's it's it's hard to go unscathed
after you've been in this business for a while even if it's frivolous right or wrong you know you're going to end up in
court whether you're a defendant or a plaintiff landlord tenant you know I mean it all kinds of things is it it's a
litigious society and we're in real estate which is very contract law heavy 100 I agree with
you on that so so one thing I wanted to get into that so a lot of people ask me how we
accumulated so many problems yes properties so quickly we were doing the Burr method before
it had that little catchy little name right so before it was a thing right
right I mean that's cool so but that's what we were doing if if you follow that
you understand it's by right rehab rent
refinance repeat and rejoice Right add another hour on there but we were doing that
exclusively using a hard money lender so the the reason we were able to move so
quickly now now keep in mind again this is in the 90s interest rates were double
digits so yeah because the interest rates are high right now the sky is not falling I try to let the newbies know
you have not seen a buyer's market you've not seen High interest rates we've been spoiled right the thought
this guy's not falling because we went to what six percent now right it was nine ten percent I saw lean contracts at
14 16 percent so anyways our hard money lender who we
used exclusively was lending 65 of the ARV okay
10 points in 18 interest with a six-month balloon
and we used them all day long now in points yes 10 points now here's the
difference here's the differences from today back then we were buying mostly bank owned properties and that's before
the banks became investors right now you see bank owned properties that are being fixed up and rent you know back then
they just had to get them off their books yeah right and we bought a house for six thousand dollars that had more
than the six thousand dollar water bill at the closing I was like so the bank lost money but they got them off their
books because after the the banks in in their mortgage department they have too
many non-producing assets they there that department can be you know they do their audits and
stuff they can suppress their their lending ability yes in their mortgage department and
because they have too many non-producing assets so they needed to get them off the book so they could keep lending they
didn't care if they took a loss right they could keep lending now you know the
the Real Estate Investors and everything and and so it makes a little bit harder to make a profit off of bank owned
properties reos right but that's what we are buying almost exclusively or buying
other rentals from other investors so using the hard money
lender even though that those were the the terms we were still making it work
because we had a crew we got them in there they were not major rehabs right
quick flips and so we were getting them fixed up and we were we would
you know in the neighborhood uh now most of our properties were Inkster Westland
Romulus right Taylor and but in that area and so you know
neighborhoods while you're working on them it attracts a lot of attention and
so a lot of would-be tenants would inquire so we have business cards at the
door you know with our with our contractor we left sign in the yard and everything right so most of the time we had it rented before it was even done
yeah it was before it was even completed and so we were able to refinance the
property without having to wait that six-month seizing period because we were
only refinancing for rate and term which means now the property is worth
I forgot what we were buying them at you know fifty thousand now it's worth a hundred thousand right and so we can
refinance it as long as we're not trying to put any cash in our pocket at the closing that's when you need the
seasoning period even to this day the lenders want you to wait six months or longer sometimes before you put cash in
your pocket so if if we came in with our own cash and we tried doing the Burr method we
would have to wait six months to pull our cash back out by using the hard money lender we were able to use we were
able to move faster so that high interest rate didn't matter that much because we only used it for a few months
guys and it was long term that 18 would have ate Us Alive so yeah from you know 18 to refinance it
down to I don't know whether eight percent or something like that I mean whatever they were at prison it was a
state facility had a good job so the lenders loved them so anyways we were able to refinance I think we were eight
percent so now we're cash flowing right not as much as we would at you know three or four percent but we were still
making it work so we were doing that all day long and just in and out in and out of this hard money loan
and then our hard money lender would believe it or not would even roll in those 10 points as long as it fit within
that 65 percent which we always made sure it did yeah but which wasn't smart
now we're paying 18 on 10 points yeah right but because we knew it was a very
short term and they weren't large loans they might have been 50 or 70 000 right so that's why we were able to move able
to move so quickly and we were able to get so many properties and that's the difference between back in the 90s
versus now is the price points were not what they are now you know doing that
now at that interest rate yeah would bankrupt somebody you know
but back then keep in mind rents were lower too so you know you got the give
and take as well but so on average how what kind of
rehab did you guys do was it a medium-sized Rehab on most properties was it was it a full gut no no we never
got into anything major because we knew when when you've got a hard money loan at that at 18 interest yeah
you got to move fast yeah right so we were mostly paint carpet kitchen
bathroom got it nothing nothing structural
no roofs no you know so we made sure we were in and out quick
awesome so so with that being said there's a you know obviously following
that exactly is a little bit different nowadays than it was then but the same
type of procedure still works yeah you getting a hard money loan if you don't
want to wait that seasoning period which now on I think it's Fanny
Fannie or Freddy if you're going conventional I now they changed it from
six months to to a year for the seasoning period for cash out yes out see that's what I'm
saying so we can use our own cash or do we use a hard money lender and the difference is yeah
we're going to save money and points and payments and stuff but waiting that six months and tying our money up we
wouldn't be able to move as fast so that's why we went over the hard money lender so and this is where I I want to
let people know that if you're doing this you know if you pull out the money for
just the terms and to pay off the loan most banks don't care about the
seasoning period and that's that's where you're getting and that's how you were able to move so fast we just wanted to
go from 18 to 8 or whatever it was and start cash flowing because it was rented
at that point because it has to be rented and then we need to show your income you have
to show the income for that property right yeah right now things are different now because
now they want to see income on that property for a year or you have to
qualify with your income to qualify for the the payment right so it's a little
bit different but I mean if you you know if your income's there like from other properties or whatever and you can show
it then yeah that's not an obstacle that's awesome so so you got into
you got into working you know with your husband to get these rental
properties and your goal was 10 within the first year and you end up doing nine
okay now obviously because you came up short for one property did he still end
up quitting his job yeah what once the net income
accumulated from Oliver rentals matched his salary that's when he quit that's
awesome and that was in 2000 that was in 2000 okay so that is crazy because going
from there going doing that in a year that is a huge test I still work my day
job but I also like my day job too so that's a huge difference that's a big
difference so my husband said he literally felt like he went to prison every day the difference is he got to come home at
night exactly it was it was stressful yeah so I had the same rule but mine is
I have to match 125 of my income yeah
and the reason why I say 125 is because you got 401K you're putting into you got
your benefits and you got all this other stuff that you're putting into that
makes a W-2 worth it yeah in my opinion that's about 25 give
or take you know so so I that's kind of where I put that plus you got a figure too
you know what if a tenant or two doesn't pay exactly
right you never want to be at the the mercy of rent collection to pay your
mortgage exactly so yeah you want to have a little bit of a question so
with that being said how so where are you at right now with your rentals
so your first year you got nine we had fast forward to 2003
we had I was thinking about this earlier and I was trying to remember the exact number
I think it was 37. we had a five unit building and a five unit commercial
building in Romulus and the rest were single family homes okay and in 2003
we decided to get the heck out of Michigan and move to a warmer climate we moved to I mean
how much warmer can you get than Arizona and so this this is another thing that
we experienced you know this is a lease option story
I had never been to Arizona but we just know we we knew we wanted to get to a warmer climate and since my husband
basically flew to work we could live anywhere as long as it was
near an airport and so one of the other mentors that worked for the company moved from Ohio to
Arizona and so you're going to love it here and everything so we said hey find us a lease option I've never been there
but I want to kick the tires so you you know the benefits of selling on lease
option right there's there's a lot of benefits there's also benefits on buying
our research so in our situation I had never been to Arizona and but we did a two-year lease
option so this way if I hated it we there was no obligation to buy we could
just up and leave we didn't anything else so it was it was
a good option for us so that's what we did and you know I loved Arizona so we ended
up staying eight and a half years we were in a million and a half dollar property on an acre with a
eight-car garage and a pool The Grotto and I I really thought that
we were going to stay there like forever real estate market was nothing like it is here
we didn't do it a lot in real estate didn't hold any rentals because then nothing cash flowed
and this area that we were in was fastest growing city neck and neck with
Cape Coral at the at the time and Cape Coral Florida so anyways
everything was new everything was built up in new new freeways were going in so there wasn't a lot of rehab
opportunities like there is you know in Detroit or
you know it's older how the you know 20s 30s 40s that that we can rehab and
increase the value there wasn't a lot of that there and people were depending on their
you know appreciation and depreciation where you know I'm from Metro Detroit I
I need to get paid every month or else I'm not getting into it right yeah so didn't hold a lot of rentals or anything
we did mostly business financing corporate structuring and stuff like that but okay
as well as the the mentorship but anyways so the lease option worked for us so
we refinanced and everything and then fast forward to 2011 we decided to come back to Michigan
because family is more important than Paradise
so but you know I'm glad to be back because this is home this is where I'm
from I grew up in Belleville and this is where our family's at the
real estate Market's better you know Springs spring summer and
fall happy to be here winter I would like to be somewhere else see in Arizona
we didn't get the Four Seasons you know we got rain like four times a year and
you know obviously no snow but it was either winter like like in the middle of the winter Christmas season it was like
65 degrees which is beautiful yep but it's like it's only hot or hotter
we're out here I love the fall I love the Four Seasons and stuff so Michigan is home that's good so so with that you
know when you moved out to Arizona do you still had all your rentals here correct no so that's
you know I have some regrets when when we're
we're hitting a touchy subject here so in 2003 when we knew we were we were moving
the property management companies were just I mean the horror stories
about there were really no good property management companies that we knew of right
so we didn't want to worry about that stuff halfway across the country right
and so we sold everything liquidated yeah now this is before the crash yep
okay so the good part about this is that we didn't lose anything during the crash so we didn't get hit like a lot of
people did because we sold a few years you know five years before yeah so you know that that was some
of them we held for less than a year so you know we had that capital gains penalty that we had to answer to and
stuff so you know like I said some regrets and then I'm thinking too like here I am 30 years later they would have
all been paid for you know I've been sitting on them but you know hey I got them once I can get them again yes
fast forwarding the the long-term rentals that I did have in 2017 I changed it to short-term
rentals and got into the Airbnb business been doing that since 2017 I've had
13 of those okay oh yeah kind of I've been super host since the day I
jumped on so this is something I really they really enjoy and be in in the account in in the
hospitality business yeah it's different than being a long-term landlord yeah so
I did an episode with Nick Bastianelli and he is a short-term rental guy but
he's also a real estate agent and he developed a lot of these automation systems to deal to deal
with the short-term rentals where he basically doesn't have anything to do you know but yeah that's where okay
that's where I'm a dinosaur yeah because everything now like I when I do my
mentorships or my coaching it's like one-on-one let's do a zoom call let's give him the phone call or whatever
and and I can teach you strategies I can teach you you know contracts and everything else but
you know I'm I'm keep in mind when I started there was no internet so we we you know I'm pen and
paper and I can appreciate when I do business with other veteran investors
that been doing this you know 20 25 30 years because we're all analog
and all this this new technology and and stuff
I don't know about anybody else my air my age but I'm I'm having a hard time keeping up and so like you said
everything's automated and he's got this and this and this I'm you know I don't have a team I work solo
we have a cleaner for my real my my short-term rentals that's that's as far as it gets yeah right and then my my son
and I serve papers together. I'm a process server. I've been doing that since I was 19.
and I I used to serve papers when I was pregnant with him and now 26 years
later he's well I just served somebody at 6 30 tonight wow yeah yeah so
so you know other than that I don't have a team I kind of do everything myself so I've kind of learned how to do
things you know pen and paper yeah it was I taught myself spreadsheets I mean
that's how bad it is right yeah so but I can email I I do okay I do okay
but this this new technology and stuff is
is something that I really lack yes
honestly I think to take your your short-term rentals to the next level
watch that episode if you want to get a hold of them get a hold of them because I think it's really cool because what he
does is he takes for on booking they go into one calendar so
that none of them can be double booked and then not only that but he also has
on that calendar like every time somebody leaves it's automatically I like the it's on a lock box where uh and
then he has backups redundancies stuff like that but at least with the electronic lock
box they are only given that code for and it's only good for that certain amount of time yep yeah no now that you
I'm all that yeah so I was going to do that but I'm there all uh all the time anyways I'm very Hands-On so I'm there
you know before yeah so I just manually check it but yeah I did get there's a
little Wi-Fi adapter you have to buy to do that and change the code uh remotely you can unlock the door and everything
but I'm I'm close to my places so yeah so there was uh yeah
honestly I like I think it would be really good for you to watch or even yeah I will but
because a lot of his short-term rentals are actually on the other side of the state and he's he lives over here
so I make a role to stay within 20 minutes away from my places
I've I've shut down some would-be parties so I like that
so yeah so I think that was the reason why he forced himself to go fully remote
on that because of that he didn't want to be a Hands-On that Hands-On you know
so but anyways we're kind of digressing here so the short-term rentals you're
getting into those okay you're getting into uh I've been doing short-term
rentals since 2017 so 17 yeah yeah so that's awesome and
are you still buying properties at the moment or are you just wholesaling like how did you get into wholesaling so
wholesaling is where I started it's where a lot of people start and but what I like and I and I believe
everyone should learn wholesaling whether you want a wholesale or not is because you know if if you're even on
the MLS and you're looking for something you find something that that might be you know a decent deal there's some
deals on the MLS and you put in three offers and two of
them get accepted for example but you only have the cash to buy one you're gonna cherry pick which one you want to
buy what are you going to do with the other one walk away from it no it's still a decent deal wholesale it lock it
up under contract and assign the contract right you're still going to close on the one you're going to close on but why walk away for money
right that might be five or ten thousand dollars you can make up because you've already negotiated you've analyzed it
you negotiated you got a good deal there but you can't act on it find someone else who can so
even if you're not a wholesaler if you're actively buying you that should always be
something that you should know how to do 100 I agree with you wholesaling in my
opinion and it is for me it's it's a Gateway into real estate and it's a way to see
how it's a way to get into real estate get
into this and see what direction you want to go okay see whether you want to
do buying holes whether you want to do fix and flips whether you want to do lease options sub to whatever or all all
of the above you know so wholesaling and flipping is like working paycheck to
paycheck yes right when you stop hustling the money stops yep right and
it's a hustle it's a hustle the flips are bigger paydays but they're farther in between and then
wholesaling it is what you put into it right I mean I
a lot of new wholesalers don't don't
this doesn't help new wholesalers right but all of my deals
come from referral yep I I don't Market for
to to get my deals I'll Market to sell them to get them but all my deals Come to Me by referral
that's just because hey I've done the bandit signs I've done the direct mailings I've done the door knocking the
driving for dollars and I've never done cold calling okay or by leads I've never
bought leads I never bought leads until I got my life insurance license right I've always
been taught to bring the you know advertise and bring the people to me so the band
designs and then right so I still have my penny buys houses magnetic signs that
we had on our truck back in the 90s I still have them but but anyways the the long-term wealth
or the passive income comes with your rentals you know because once you do the work you accumulate you know your
rentals that then the money comes in every month hopefully you know you know
you shouldn't have to do me maintenance on a house every single month but you know it's it's it's it's a lot easier
than hustling for that next deal repeatedly month after month after month after month but you've got to do what
you got to do to get to that point so if you're wholesaling to flip and then
flipping to hold right using the same money you wholesale enough properties
you can buy a flip right you've got 50 or 60 000 accumulated from your
wholesaling deals you can buy a cheap flip you might turn that into 85 or 90
or 100 000 use that hundred thousand thousand to buy your next Flip or so
forth but you're still wholesaling right now you're able now you've got some cash
so you can cherry pick those wholesale deals what might work for you go seal
the rest but now you'd be like oh that's in my neighborhood that's in my area that's a quick flip that's only a ten or
fifteen thousand dollar you know I can do that quick the rents are good and silver so and then wholesale the rest
right instead of stepping over them right step over a dollar to pick up a
dime but you know at the same time it's good to know
you know have knowledge about all of your possibilities so that you don't have to turn down any opportunities
yeah no I I 100 agree with you on that and I think that
you know getting again getting to know all these different ways to do things different
strategies different strategies like it just makes you a better investor yeah okay so so I'll go to a seller and like
I said I'll analyze the the properties you know analyze four-ways always right
so lowball cash offer right here's here's my number
if you'll entertain a lease option or land contract or a subject to yep right
they can't do a lowball cash offer if they don't have the equity right because the hands are tied they can't do it yeah
right and so it's not always a distressed property sometimes it's a distressed situation yes right they got
into a property they can't afford the payments anymore they they didn't want to go into foreclosure well guess what
I'll come in I'll just take over your payments right I'm you know but now you have to
analyze that because what are your options at that point again there's no equity so you can't flip that property
your only option is to hold that as a rental can you do that is there structural damage is there you know
fifty thousand dollars worth of deferred maintenance that you know or work that has to be done there's a roof caving in
that's not something just because the opportunity of subject to deal is there that you you have to jump on it you
still have to analyze it and know what you're doing right but all those you
know almost every contract is assignable so whether you got a subject to or a lease option or in contract you can
assign those to another buyer for a fee if you don't want to stay in the deal but you have to analyze that deal as if
you are yes because other investors are not suckers right they're going to analyze it so you have to present a good
deal to them if you're if you plan on you know being a wholesaler that's worth
of them right you got to know what you're doing I've even partnered with my
sellers right so if if the sellers see for example they want a hundred thousand
dollars for the property and it needs fifty thousand dollars in work say the arvs 200 000. so I'm not including soft
costs or commissions or anything like that so say for example I you know I
only have 50 000 in cash I don't have a hundred and fifty thousand to pay them a hundred and then put 50 into it so Mr
and Mrs seller let's partner add me to the deal to create an LLC
whatever needs to be done right and I'm not going to pay you for the property right now but I'm gonna pay the fifty
thousand dollars in re in the repairs now we own a property that's worth two
hundred thousand okay now we sell it for two hundred
you get your 100 I get my 50 we split what's what's different what's
left right now the seller made a hundred and twenty five thousand yep instead of a hundred I made 50 on my
money but I didn't have to buy the house I all I had to do was put fifty thousand into
it I made I made a 50 foot on a property so if
it's a win-win situation and you can work it out sometimes partnering with the seller is
the best option yeah you never want someone to walk away from a deal feeling like they get cheated
right they won't do business with you again if you do good business you'll do
more business they'll refer you to their friends and their family and say hey you're in a tough situation that I was
in a tough situation here's who I went to she'll help you out and I totally agree with that you gotta do business
ethically no matter what uh well I have ethics training with my real estate license my insurance
insurance license I trust me I know and and then I see the mistakes that people
make yeah I see property managers out there that are not licensed they have the proper licensing so that that's
that's another reason why you know again on Tuesday I passed my broker's exam because it was important that
everything's in compliance before I open shop yep no I 100 agree
with you on that and first off congratulations on your broker's license 30 years in the making
never thought I'd needed it let's go now because like I said I
exactly right but you know what you could have team members you could have whatever you know or anything like that
or not to start delegating yeah and you know obviously I and that
actually brings me to uh a quick you know we we can continue the discussion offline that's no problem but
I definitely think that you know there might be some areas where you can
do some automatization or I can even help you on some of that in either your wholesaling or some of
your other businesses just because I've been doing this with the newer and doing it mainly from
home as much as possible so so we definitely can get together and work out something like that no problem
I'm always here to help anybody you know so yeah I need I need help the
younger generation technology yeah so with that
you know what is it you're doing right now though so you're doing you you
mentioned you're doing the wholesale and you're you mentioned you're doing the the short-term rentals
what else are you are you getting in to fix some flips are you getting into yeah buying more buy and holds yeah
yeah for sure so like I said I I don't have any long-term rentals right now I changed
them all to short-term rentals and then I downsized from that after my my husband passed away about two and a half years ago so I had to regroup and and
downsize thank you but right now what I do is
real estate's always been my bread and butter right but it's not what I've done
longest but about four years before I got into real estate I started a legal service and I've
worked for over 200 attorneys in the Metro Detroit area Okay I was doing I
had eight employees I was 19 years old I had eight employees and but I was doing a lot of court
filings and getting annoyed by judges and things that's changed because a lot of done electronically now but I still serve
papers I'm a process server and it's gonna tell you tons of stories about that but
anyway so I do that with my son now and yeah so I'm uh yeah I'm a real estate
investor I do a lot of wholesaling like for example anything in Detroit that comes my way I'll wholesale that
I'm not gonna I'll hold anything but out here you know I'm in the Ann Arbor area so out this way I'll look into you know
holding flipping definitely always an option
right now you know the price is fluctuating I I do have my contractor that I I know and trust so that's an
obstacle for a lot of people contractors the biggest obstacle when it comes to flipping
but I have my life insurance broker's license
I'm a life insurance broker I've been doing that for a couple years actually got my license after my my husband
passed away so but I am side note I'm looking into
the infinite banking concept which actually is a very nice marriage between
my real estate license and my life insurance license yes because and it's it's fabulous but I never
teach anything that I don't know or I've actually done so I'm learning about this
because I want to have that most accurate information and be able to to do it properly but that is very very
intriguing to me especially For Real Estate Investors be your own bank right be your own
Banker there's a book that I'm actually reading right now but I do one-on-one mentorships coaching
I can do a group setting I've got an Airbnb class coming up later this month
with a with a broker in Wyandotte I've got some eBooks and things like
that you know just trying to help people but I do a lot of wholesaling I mean as
far as what I've done and what I teach lease options land contracts subject
to obviously short-term rentals I actually love being a host uh it is
different but I spoil my guests uh like crazy and I I don't get anything less
than five star reviews but and like I said I'll partner with uh
people I do have a lot of people that say you know I've I've got the funds I've
got the means I just don't have the knowledge or the experience I don't want to make the mistakes yeah we can partner
together and you know split the proceeds or whatever I'm open to that I've always been open to that
but my suggestion to people especially if they're getting started is
to learn everything that you can learn you don't want to come into this business ignorant or not knowing
you know as well as I know you've seen it can be vicious
they can be vicious when it's like there's some sharks out there that if
they're gonna sense don't know what you're doing when you're out there pretending like you do they'll Eat You
Alive I mean I see it and it's a very male dominant industry I'm speaking I'm a female at this point very male
dominant industry and I have no problem giving it a pissing contest
chances are I've been doing it longer than them and I know more but I'm always good up for a good
challenge but another thing too that people have to understand is
when you're putting in offers and you're negotiating with someone always ask ask ask every the answer to every
question that you don't ask is always no yes and a good example of that is is back in
uh back back in the day when we were buying up I mean we were we were buying four or five I mean getting accepted
offers four or five properties a month okay we were wholesaling and we were cherry picking the ones that we wanted
to keep as rentals and so forth but there was one property that that we were
negotiating on and there was it was it was a nice brick ranch it was an Inkster and
it was a beautiful octagon picnic table in the backyard I went oh we like
the we like the picture so we were we actually put in the offer that they they
left the picnic table as part of the sale right and they were oh man we can't we can't leave the picnic table you know
that was a wedding gift from you know so and so but we can let you keep the
dog no if you don't want the dog we don't
have any use for this dog you know so but the answer was no but what I'm saying is that you never know we've
we've put offers on car with on houses that had cars in the garage you know
down Mercedes we want that Mercedes and and included in a sale but you never
know what you're gonna get unless you ask so always ask and and
I had heard uh there's a saying that said if you're if you're if
you're not embarrassed by your offer it wasn't low enough you know what I've heard that so many
times it is it is but it's true yeah because if they if they immediately immediately
say yes you you're like okay there's some there's some motivation there there's either
motivation or no basically you're not doing your numbers right but when we were buying
with a hard money lender when I was dealing with the sellers I would basically tell them look based on the
financing that we can get because we can't get traditional financing because of the condition okay we both know this
place is a dump right there's no denying that yep right so so based on the
financing that we're able to get for this place we have to be below this
number I'm not trying to lowball you I'm not trying to play games this is the
numbers this is what we're dealing with so we can't come higher you know our hands are tied we can't and so when we
would explain that to the seller they would understand and not make it look like we're just trying to take advantage of them we explained that this is our
financing options right so no 100 agree with you on that
and I really think that that is super super helpful tips because the
thing is is that we don't want we're not going after these perfect houses that
are brand new or brand new builds or or just five years old and they don't need
a ton of work we're going after these dumps that need a ton of work right you know well that's the motivation to get a
discount if you don't have that motivation then what's the point right you're not going to get a house that
needs no work in perfect condition unless the seller is in a bad situation you know themselves
I always love it when I get talk to new buyers and I'm like okay well what is it
you want all we only want to do with the suburbs you know Oakland County
if it's Macomb then more North you know like everybody else and oh by the
way we only want carpet paint remodels that's it and like you and everybody else buddy
yeah to get in line I'm like doing everybody else looking for you're gonna have to change
some of that criteria real quick especially if you say you want it at a 70 discount yeah so either you're gonna
pay more for it or you're going to be waiting a pretty long time so to do a little bit bigger of a
rehab so now with that going you know you said
you do mentorships you do you have courses things like that how did you get into doing all that
well when we when we went from students to trainers yeah with Russ the Russ with
me back in the you know late 90s that's right yeah yeah so we started mentoring
and and stuff there and it was all you know I mean it was all great information and the students were very very
successful yeah so that's it's just basically I mean
so you just continued that on your own versus with that organization yeah
because just in conversation with people or things like this that say you know so
I don't really I don't have like a big you know again the technology
deficiency here but you know I so I don't I don't even think I want to get
it to that point because that's a lot of responsibility of delivering that but you know privately one-on-one or if
you know somebody says oh I got 10 people you know you want to do it you want a class you want to do a class to
teach my realtors how to be more investor friendly or something like that
or you know get a group of 10 people to teach a bus subject to I'd do you know more smaller settings yeah like that
that I'm more comfortable with but I can definitely you know for my knowledge and experience and again I
stay up on on top of the laws you know when the Dodd-Frank Act came into into place and things like that uh you know
the the subject to some laws have changed with that as well
landlord tenant laws are always changing so you know you got to stay up
on if you're in this business you gotta you know the laws and things are always changing but the concepts kind of stay
the same the theories of of you know how subject to and how lease options and land contracts work
yeah so that that's really good to know really good to hear as well and
so with that anybody who has any interest and stuff like that you know
stay to the end well you know you'll be able to get our contact info also it is
in the description below uh where I put all her contact information and any any
of the links that she wanted me to put in there I put them in the description below so check that out as well so I've
got some eBooks on my website one thing to that I mentioned is they're they're they're not extremely
long because I and this probably works against me but I don't like when I get
an ebook or a book that I get or the first three chapters is you know telling me about their feelings and how they
grew up and what went into real estate and you know I you know I don't mean
to be insensitive but I don't I don't really give a I want to know you know give me the meat and potatoes and
so that's that's my my stuff it just kind of gets right into the just a just a quick intro about how
you did you're successful blah blah blah okay this is how I did it you know so not even the intro I don't know okay
I've been doing this for this as long and you know here you go but I mean so
it's kind of like like I said it probably works against me because that's you know three chapters of fluff but is
it that's not in there it just gets down to it and I always tell everybody that you know
if there's anything that doesn't make sense or there's follow-up questions or anything I'm I'm available I'm
accessible if you have questions I'm always happy to answer them so I'll help anybody as as much as I can so
those are there I've got like four or five eBooks on my website
the one-on-one even if it's just like if you just want to learn about subject two or just learn about lease options or
sandwich lease options or short-term rentals Airbnb or anything like that
if I haven't done it I'm not going to teach it got it that that's a pet peeve of mine so Larry Shepard from
Facebook I actually asked uh can you share more about your mentorship program as far as cost and for one-on-ones so
that's another thing too is I I another pet peeve I have is people just really gouging their prices like so I'm if you
want to just do like a general session for like an hour it's like 99 bucks if
you want to learn specifically about a uh you know lease options seeing which lease options
or subject to or land contracts or just a specific yeah or wholesaling or
something like that just a specific strategy we can I can do a zoom session we can
usually you know split it up but it takes you know a couple few hours I cannot cover everything and give you my
contracts and and everything that's usually at like 249 dollars so I try to
keep my stuff you know real affordable that's very affordable honestly yeah so
yeah most definitely and by the way anybody who is asking uh as far as one-on-ones I do one-on-ones for new
beginners for anybody just for for advice things like that I I'm not even charging at the moment
the reason I'm not charging you is because I want to be able to record it and use it for content on our channel so
that's the trade-off I'll do a one-on-one with you you give me they use that as content you know so next year
I plan on I'll plan on possibly charging for it but come to that bridge when it comes to it so I want to help out as
many people as possible that's my goal so at least put that out there but uh with that being said you know
so what is it that people from here can help you with going in the future
and how can we help you the group as well as what is it what is
the future hold for Terry penny well now that I have my broker's license
I you know I can use that for a few different things I can open up my own brokerage with agents under me but
that's not the direction I'm going in because I'm not really in like again off Market as my comfort zone but I am going
to use my broker's license to start a Manage Property Management Company so I'm in Washington
County we want to be centrally located around Belleville maybe which so that
helps us with Washington County Western Wayne County Monroe County you know going north going south going east
probably no farther than Redford so we won't be managing Detroit okay
I've been there done that you know managed 150 houses the the rehabbing
rental and and and so I we're just too far away right
but you know we'll probably go as far west as Jackson because we already have properties
out in Jackson right now so might as well stay out there that going
so I'm going to be working on ramping that up so I'll be open to managing some properties I've been managing on my own
properties for over 30 years my contractor has been in construction for over 30 years I don't know why we didn't do this sooner
yeah but anyways we've got that coming up and I
know people are are good honest and ethical property manager that's that's
you know got everything uh in compliance and so I'm looking forward to Growing
that other than that I'm you know again I've I've got a lot of things going on
I got a lot of them tied together with real estate my short-term
rentals my insurance rate my broker's license at all ties together so got it
the only thing that doesn't tie with real estate is my process serving but
I enjoy working with attorneys it's just mindset
yeah so actually a side note I well I would I should say had my insurance
license from a long time ago my life insurance license yeah I did that for a while
and I it was uh it was crazy because
uh sorry I so I had that for a while and
uh and it's crazy because uh
I went on I did one appointment I I did all the cold calling did all that and just realized it wasn't for me so
was that before covert yes yeah so now not too many appointments in person
the commissions are crazy but it is a hard sell yep so I'm not you know I'm
not one to do cold calling or buy leads and you know that that's just not me I'm not on
the phone eight hours a day and saying hey you need life insurance that's just not how I'm cut some people
make a killing doing it I mean I'm seeing some killing in 20 30 grand a month but
what I am trying to entwine the life insurance with is again the infinite
banking concept where you can get a life insurance policy and then you can pay into it I'm just gonna give you a recap
again I'm learning more about it but you can pay into it and
say you make a profit off of one property as a from the angle from a real
estate investor right of being your own bank if you make a profit off of a flip right but obviously in this market
especially you're not going to find your your next flip right away so you you deposit that in there and you keep feeding that into that you can into a
life insurance policy now you can withdrawal most of that 90 78 this is again I got
to get the details yeah and and so what's happening is with the insurance
the insurance carrier the there's a compound like a compound interest yeah
right so you're you're getting paid dividends based on how much is in there now you would do a withdrawal from that
and you say you pull fifty thousand dollars from it to buy a property or
whatever you're going to fix it up it doesn't interrupt that building process what happens is you're pulling from the
benefits so if you die the next day say you got a two hundred thousand dollar policy and
you pull out 50 you die the next day your family is just going to get fifty thousand dollars less yeah you've
already pulled that out but you can pull that out and your compounding yeah Dividends are still
going to accumulate as if it's you know the 50 000 is still in there yeah so this is what I'm learning more about
because you can tap into that for real estate for a car loan or whatever and
instead of paying that bank six or eight or ten percent interest you pay it to
yourself and there's no one breathing down your neck to say oh if you miss a payment we're going to foreclose on you
because it's your account it's your money and there's no application process there's no appraisal there's no one
saying no you can't so it's it's powerful and if and once I learn how to
entwine those together with that and the real estate and with me having my life insurance license I can set them up with
that with a plan and and that's a big thing too is having a plan going back to
why we got into getting rentals back in the 90s is the plan was for my husband
to quit his job so if you're just into this just oh I just need to make money
no you need to have a plan what is your goal yeah right where are you now your goals are going to change right your
timeline might change but you gotta have something that you're working towards or else you're just hustling
right you gotta know what you're hustling for yeah so also you know that it's really
cool you know but I'm I want to learn more about that the
infinite baking especially because I have a background because I did that
life insurance stuff so I know about it and yeah I'll let you know once I get
there again that's something I'm studying now but it's intriguing to me I I like it
yeah so with that how can people get a hold of you to talk about all this and
I know we usually go for about an hour and a half I'm gonna have to cut this a little short
you'll run about an hour and 12 minutes right now but how can people get a hold of you to talk about anything any of this stuff
that you brought up or anything like that so I've got
my my I've got a couple different websites my main one is terrypenny.com t-e-r-r-y p e n n y.com
yeah My email is moneypenny2k
at gmail.com because I'm Mrs Moneypenny yeah and that's why I go on that's my
short-term rentals my profile says Mrs Moneypenny yeah and uh and Mrs
Moneypenny likes to spoil her guests with wine and chocolates and all kinds of snacks so anyways
my number is 734-392 -4880 awesome one more time for people
who are a little bit slower like me for 3
4 8 -0 moneypenny2k@gmail.com yeah so that
that's really cool and we can anybody who has any questions by all means reach out to or
talk with her if you want to do the entrepreneurship uh or sorry if you
wanna if you want to do the mentorship with her please reach out I think you know grabbing from her experience is 100
that's why you do a mentorship so if you're just starting out and
looking to do a couple just one-on-ones reach out to her as well you can also reach out to me as well
my number is right here at the bottom right there and kind of go from there all right and then I I do have I have
a lot of wholesale deals I think I just added what 30 years oh my God I saw that yeah yeah so that's crazy they might be
priced a little high I get that okay yeah I'm getting comments thank you for your comments
are accepted right I know but you know you can only do so much with the seller
right I mean I try to maneuver as much as I can but my my website for my real
estate investing if you guys want to take a look at any deals I have I've got some commercial properties from
Residential Properties rentals vacant lot so forth It's corleyonrealestate.com deal so it's
c-o-r-l-e-o-n-realestate.com deals if you do slash deals that'll get you right into the page where the deals
got it and Corleone let me just explain that so there's no e at the end so it's Corleone so is a combination I
have four boys Christian Jordan Jalen Zion so the Corleone is a combination of
their names so that's why there's no e at the end I am half I'm half Sicilian
so it just kind of flowed I had to I had to run with it and then my
I used to help run the Ann Arbor Real Estate Investors Club Brian bunningson has it but he actually came
up with my tagline I will make you an offer you can't refuse so I had to run
with that so anyways why not right look at my site and take a look at my deals that I
have and let me know if there's anything that catches your eye all right that's awesome also I know you post them on the
in the groups as well and go from there but by all means
reach out to her she's a great person I see her at the meetups all the time and love I always usually pick her brain
about something so my face group is on my face my Facebook group is
uh money pennies real estate playground yeah so if you guys want to join that
I try to get in some content and some just do some fun stuff not always deals but I like the tiny houses concept
so I post things like that or you know just some fun stuff about real estate
so I know I have a whole lot of memory I don't have as many members as you but uh that's okay though you're
working on it so I put a lot of work into the Facebook group I know you do yeah so we just hit
almost 3 600 members right now wow so congratulations everybody who's watching
on there so thank you and you know I really do
you know this sorry I was wasn't look at the comments but there was a question
of how we get a hold of the wholesale deals which we just explained yeah so
going there and then you know said Thank uh really enjoy the content and
you know thank you guys so really appreciate that I don't know who I usually have it up over here but I was
answering a text message so but I you know I'm happy to have you on anybody
else who wants to learn more get a hold of her she's great person great
personality very ethical yeah I always answer my phone so don't be afraid to call me that's
awesome I really do appreciate it all right Terry if I'm gonna just bring you down to the side and then uh uh you know
just hold on once we once once we stop real quick alright okay alright thank you Terry I appreciate it have a
good day thank you all right thank you everyone that is it for today please join us in
two weeks from this past Monday we're one week so two weeks from this past money every
other week we're going to have another another person on here don't know you who yet I have a few ideas and we're I will
keep keep a lookout for the advertisements all right thank you have a good day and let's all do deals
together.